How to Sell in 2026 with Jill Esplin

Jamie Berman  0:00  

Welcome back to the podcast. I have a special guest this week that I’m so excited to bring on because she is such a dear friend of mine who just happens to be the most masterful sales person I’ve ever met in my life, and in fact, we met during a sales conversation nine years ago, when I booked a consult and I was looking at this mastermind program, and Jill esplen, who’s on the podcast today, was on the other line, helping me navigate if this program was right for me or not, she was the one who was conducting the sales, and during the process, it was actually one of the most insightful sales conversations I ever had, because, you know what she did? She sold me on not joining the program. She said, Jamie, it doesn’t sound like this is really what you want. This doesn’t sound like it’s for you. And what she did was she actually said, I actually recommend you go do this other program that was not affiliated with her in any way, shape or form, because she had my highest interest in mind. And I will tell you what that conversation blew my mind. I’ve never felt like I wasn’t trying to be sold to and because of that, I built so much trust that later on, maybe a year later, I was on another sales call with her for a different program, which happened to be an in person retreat. And she did sell me on that one, and we have since met in person. We have become dear, dear friends. Jill has actually supported my business. You might have even talked to her or met her on one of my retreats, because she comes and supports and I just couldn’t wait to have her on the podcast, to get into her brain and learn more about her thoughts on selling on what’s working in 2026 she works with some of the best thought leaders out there. She works in sales with them. She helps them convert their funnels, and I am so excited to pick her brain and so Jill, welcome and thank you for being here. It’s

Jill Esplin  2:16  

so good. Aloha everybody. We’re literally in Hawaii. And she also didn’t mention I’m Millie’s godmother or dog sitter. So most important title,

Jamie Berman  2:26  

most important Millie is my little maltipoo, as you all know. And yes, Jill is the godmother. She saw Millie before Josh even did. So welcome Jill. I have some really good questions to ask you that I know a lot of my clients are asking, so I’m gonna pick your brain about the specifics about what people struggle with. So first thing I’m curious about is, when you come in to work with a thought leader or a coach or a company and you’re looking at their sales process, what are you seeing people doing wrong? Are there things that you’re like, oh my gosh, if you just did this, that would make a big difference. What are you seeing that like people are missing or kind of like doing I don’t know if it’s doing wrong, but it’s like a missed opportunity.

Jill Esplin  3:14  

Well, one of the biggest, I think, missed opportunities is people aren’t even getting the invite or getting to the place where they would check out, someone will say, Well, you know, I had a call with them, I sent them the next steps, and then I never heard from them, and I said, Well, did you follow up? Did you call them? Did you text them? No, I emailed them again. Like, oh, did the same email that you didn’t hear from the first time? They’re like, Yeah, okay, there’s also just a thing called deliverability, and that’s a huge issue. So I will check in with people and say, first and foremost, let’s make sure, if you’re on a call with someone, it’s great to email in real time and say, Okay, I just sent you the link. Did you get it? And you’ll know, and they’ll say, No, it went to my spam. Great. Let’s go find it, right if you don’t send them that invite or pay link in the moment, over a zoom or over an email. I always tell people text and not one of those text services where it’s like, you know, reply, no to unsubscribe, like your personal phone, and then I’ll either hear the founder or the salesperson say, but they’ll have my phone number, and I’m like, they will. What does that mean? And they’re like, well, they’ll continue to call me or email me at odd times. And I could tell you, I probably have over 1000 people’s ran more than maybe 2000 people, random numbers in my phone because of different clients, different launches, and rarely, I mean, maybe point, oh, 1% of the time, they will email me at a random time or continually misuse it. But for the most part, it is my biggest secret to like, actually convert and connect. Is just my phone to their phone. The human way people connect,

Jamie Berman  4:56  

yeah, that makes such a difference, because then they, I mean, I think the. Automated, you know, responses, they just don’t work anymore. They they used to, but I have seen such a difference bringing personal touch in. And this is something actually I didn’t mention, is that Jill has taught me so much about sales, I’m so lucky. And, you know, after I’ve shifted, Joel had mentioned Jamie, you know, in 2026 you got to be more personable, the automated responses and just hoping someone gets it is not going to do it. And ever since starting that, I probably am thinking of my last, you know, successful launch that I had, I would say probably at least 50% of the conversions came through me, texting my clients and texting people just reaching out genuinely, and it’s a totally different way to receive support. And you know, people just get back to it, and it being personable is the best, and even audio messages. So I completely agree with that. So I’m curious if there’s like, other simple things that you see people not doing in their sales funnels, that if they did it, it would increase conversions. Text messaging is one. Anything else?

Jill Esplin  6:10  

Yeah, so a sales funnel, right? Essentially, they they the consumer person. They come in some way, right, whether it’s a DM on an Instagram, whether they heard you on a podcast, whether it was a free class, and now they’re in your you know, opt in, right? So I think when we talk sales conversion and sales funnel, we always want to be clear to what is that ultimate goal is it to have them enroll in a high ticket item? So maybe we do start them at a small $7 opt in, right? A lot of people are seeing that the age old saying, right, a buyer is a buyer is a buyer. So right? Do we maybe have them start at a $7 opt in? If we buy there and we have someone go, okay, they like that $7 quick thing, they could consume. What’s the next thing? Right? This is all part of a sales funnel. The next thing. Say $49 right? You guys, as I’m saying this, you’re probably like, oh yeah, I’ve seen so many offers now, instead of a free opportunity, it’s a $49 class or a $47 class. Why? Because so many people in the market have just opted in. Don’t even watch the replay, don’t even show up, and it just goes to like, I don’t know the cloud land right, like wherever it goes. So you know, something to consider in a sales funnel is, do you start with a sale instead of even a free opt in? I know many people, and I’m not saying this is right or wrong. This is where it goes back to. It depends. And test. So I would test, if I was you, try and see how many people opt in to a paid funnel and then watch that lifetime value of that customer. Do they go on and end up spending more and buying a higher level ticket item, prod product experience, etc, versus, say, doing a free funnel and start watching, does your free funnel is that converting? Is it not but I think it’s starting to be the landscape where testing and really tracking is so important. You know, if you’ve been in the industry for years, you probably remember the days it was just a free opt in, a three day event, open cart, nurture and like, not that that’s not working, but there’s a lot more touch points in that they’ll have a VIP upgrade. They’ll have a trying to think of some recent things I’ve either seen or experienced. Call it this. You’ll have a free event. And then a very specific you call it what it is, an information session, right? And it’s literally bring your questions, you let them know this is a sales call. I’m going to answer questions, I’m going to have an offer. Why? Because trust is so big. People know when they get on exactly what it is. It’s not a bait and switch, right? So maybe you only have 12 people on that call, but those 12 people truly know why they’re there and they’re wanting to be quote, unquote, sold to. And that’s the other big thing to flip the script on, right? People are like, I don’t want to be salesy. Maybe you don’t want to be salesy, but I would hold it as how do you be honest and let people know I’m going to have an opportunity. I’m going to offer you something to buy, and I want to answer your questions. Does that make sense? Jamie, 100%

Jamie Berman  9:18  

totally. Yeah. Yeah. Love it. Love it. So what is your philosophy on sales?

Jill Esplin  9:24  

First and foremost, the thing you’re selling you have to believe in wholeheartedly. It’s the thing you want everyone to do. You want your best friend, your parents, your loved ones, if they’re the avatar, obviously, like, I’m thinking of something I believe in so much and I sell, and it’s a fitness program for women in midlife. I want everyone in my life to do this program. And when I quote, unquote, sell to someone who I don’t know they can feel my own belief in this program, in this product, in it. Why? Because I really believe it works. If you are someone who represents call it another. Their product or person, like oftentimes, I’m not selling my exact program. I’m representing others. I have to believe in it. Now, if it’s yourself, I’ve heard people say, well, it’s easier to sell for someone else. And I’ll say, No, that has absolutely not a founder should always be able to outsell a salesperson. And if a salesperson could outsell the founder, then I go back to the founder, and I’d say, All right, let’s work on your sales skills, because you should always be able to sell your program better than somebody else. You’re the Creator. You made it. If you don’t believe in it to that level, then the second thing I would say is maybe you’re just not a great salesperson. So then we can work on like, call it the tools of sales.

Jamie Berman  10:43  

Yeah, that makes so much sense. I love it. And then I know a lot of people are like, I don’t want to feel salesy. I don’t want to be pushy. I don’t want to be that energy that you know, stereotypically would be the car salesperson energy how, you know, and I witness you selling, and you do not have that. And again, like the first sales experience I had with you, you were telling me, like, I don’t think you’re a fit, and that’s why it built so much trust. So what are your thoughts on that, in terms of the people who say, I don’t want to be pushy, but also that fine line of like, not avoiding too. What would be your thoughts on that

Jill Esplin  11:22  

so pushy? To me is you’re pushing on to someone something they either aren’t interested in, they haven’t even convinced you that they want it, and you’re working harder than the person trying to buy it. If that’s a scenario, you probably are being pushy, and you’re probably not going to make the sale, because people could feel that. That’s why I think it’s so important in your sales driver, whether that’s a free event, whether that’s a call, whether that’s a funnel, but you’re giving someone the opportunity for them to know and for them to say, I need this, right? They should be sitting in the seat of, how can I get this? Maybe their objection is, I can’t afford it, right? That’s something we often hear. Well, then we look at if that’s really, really true. This could be a whole podcast in and of itself, but what I mean by that is this idea of like, Is it really true? And someone says, I can’t afford it? Is it they really can’t like, I truly cannot afford right now a $10 million home. That’s also why we pre qualify. A realtor would not even allow me to go and tour a $10 million home, because they would pre qualify me, right? So that as a founder or sales person you want to look at, right? How do you pre qualify someone for a higher price point program so you have less of I, quote, unquote, can’t afford it. Now, sometimes I can’t afford it means I really don’t want to do what it takes in order to invest in that. Because I’ve also talked to people where they say that, and I work with them, and in the end, they’re like, Okay, I actually can, you know, they’re like, I can. I’m thinking someone, they literally started, you know, doing like, the dog walking service, and that amount of money they put aside, and they put that towards the program, right? We brainstormed ways they can make extra money. The, I don’t know what it’s called, like, rover or something, you know, one of those services, right? I’ve had people, literally, I’m thinking, recently, someone said, Oh my gosh, the price of the retreat. They just sold their it was like an estate sale. Someone passed away, and they sold their, whatever goods that family member had, and was like, the price of the retreat. And they were like, Oh my gosh. Like, they didn’t even think of it until I started brainstorming with them, like, Where would they have this $5,497 and it was literally, like, close to the dollar, the amount they had. But that’s your job, right? You got to get curious with someone. You have to have them start thinking of, where is it? And the last one is, I just don’t think I’m worthy, right? On some level, people will say, I can’t afford it. And then I’ll ask them, Well, do you have a pet, or do you have a child? And they’ll say, Yeah, I have two daughters. Okay, well, if your daughter wanted to invest whatever $3,000 in XYZ program, what would you tell her? And they’re like, Well, of course, it’s my daughter. I’m like, oh, so your daughter that that you’d make it happen for your daughter, but not for you. And they’ll often say, Okay, you got me. I said, Oh boy, I thought you couldn’t afford it. They’re like, Well, I mean, so, so that’s the other part, right? A salesperson gets curious, and I think that’s one of the qualities that makes someone feels less pushy because you’re curious, you’re asking questions, you’re getting into their world. So by the end of it, I’ve asked enough questions, and I know if a the person is a good fit to Jamie’s point, right? I asked enough questions. I was curious. I wasn’t going to, quote, unquote, push something on her when what the program was she really didn’t need. And like she said, a year later, now there was trust, now there’s rapport. She. Came back for a very aligned program, and that I didn’t have to push. I just answered some questions. She made the choice on her own. Maybe we worked with a payment plan, but like, there’s a difference of pushing something versus like, the visual I have is if I put my hand out and you put your hand in my hand, I gently pull you or invite you in. That’s the feeling of like aligned sales, and that’s when it’s fun for everyone. Yeah,

Jamie Berman  15:26  

so much sense. And I think there’s also in what you’re sharing, you have to have a level of non attachment so you’re not going into it. And I remember when I first started doing consults and started doing sales, I had a lot of attachment, because I wanted to build my practice, I wanted to build my business, I wanted to get clients, I wanted to hit my goals. And so I had a lot of attachment, of like, oh my gosh, I booked this. I got to sell it to this person. This will help me reach my goal. And that energy did not work. I did not sell from that place. And I remember like, having this insight, like, I got to let go of this, because, number one, it doesn’t feel good. Number two, it’s not me. Number three, it’s not working. So once I realized it, I was like, Okay, what if I truly come from this place of just service, of just like, being really neutral. And of course, you want to attract clients. But my thought was, for each one, I only want them in if this is for the highest good for them, like, I do not want to sell them on something that’s not right for them, and that made all the difference, right? So what I’m hearing is like, you also hold that, and I witness you holding non attachment. You’re not trying. You’re just trying to help them make the best decision for them, and you’re believing in them and helping them brainstorm and helping them get to that place. And for some people, I don’t know, I guess maybe people would say, Well, yeah, that’s easier if it’s you know, you’re selling for someone else’s business to hold non attachment, but when it’s your business and there’s these goals and there’s this overhead, it might be harder. Do you have any any advice for people who feel very attached when they’re on sales calls or when they’re in launches, or, you know, when they’re emailing, or, you know, selling

Jill Esplin  17:09  

No, and I hear that there’s a lot on the line, and I think, you know, it could go both ways. Right? If you’re working on behalf of someone, you’re often given a KPI, or these are the numbers you have to hit. And you know, I remember telling someone recently, it was a team that I trained up the sales people, and then I left, was like, a two year engagement. And I said something I was talking to the general manager, I don’t know, six months later, and I said, Are they scared at all? Like, do they have any fear? And she’s like, No, I don’t think so. And I said, Oh, that’s not so good. I said, I said, I mean, I don’t want them losing sleep in the middle of the night, but I care so much about my clients that I would wake up in the middle of the night losing sleep if I didn’t hit my goal. And I’m not saying that had an attachment, but I had high intention and high action, meaning I would text, I would email, I would call. I’m in the power of three, the rule of three, if I reach out three times and I don’t hear back. Okay, I’ve been ghosted if I reach out one time, well, the burden’s on me to reach out again. If I reach out again, great. Most of the time they respond on the second time, not the second, it’s the third, and they usually respond with a I am so sorry. And they have a reason why they didn’t get back. And then we have a conversation. And even if they get back the third time, and it’s Hey, I’m so sorry I didn’t get back. I’m not interested. At least I know. And I’m like, Thank you. Thank you for letting me know, right? And that’s a closed, like open loop, right? A closed Yes, they are a No, and I can mark that down as a no. And I think too many people just leave it open, and then they hope and wish. Okay, well, maybe these five people will get back. Oh, it’s been a week. Oh, maybe we didn’t wait another three days. And I’m like, just reach out. Like, and then people say, What do you reach out with? And I’m like, a genuine method message. So if I was reaching out to Jamie, I would just say, you know, Hey, Jamie, I know we spoke three days ago about X, Y, Z, in that case, it was a mastermind program. I’m just following up. I know you mentioned you wanted to think about it. I’m curious, three days later where you’ve landed with it. If it’s helpful, I’d love to get on another call. If you have the clarity, it’s not a right fit. I’d also love to know that I’m here. If you have any questions, let me know, How simple is that? Like, all those options are welcomed and great, and a lot of times you get ghosted because someone thinks, oh, I don’t want to get back and say no, but you can also, I’m not saying make it easy for them to say no, but you can give them all of those options are okay, as Jamie was saying, right? It’s like someone could feel when they could just be real, you know? So I forget your original question, how I got on that, but it

Jamie Berman  19:44  

was about non attachment, or attachment, or, you know, what your thoughts are on that?

Jill Esplin  19:48  

Yeah, and I do think there should be a level of investment, right? That’s why, when I laughed with the general manager, she’s like, No, I wish they had a little more fear, you know, like you can’t make someone want a sale, but there is something. About, you know, wanting to support someone having that sale come in, and it’s the person’s journey you’re helping and the person the thing you’re selling. And there also is, I think, a healthy alignment to having a business that works, you know, and if you’re not having enough leads, or you’re not having enough sales at that point, I think you look at your offer and say, is the offer no longer what people want? Is it priced too high? Is it, you know, are we not aligning with the right demographic? Do we need to be marketing this elsewhere? So if sales aren’t coming in, it’s less about you, and more the question again with curiosity, where is this program? Where is this product in today’s market? Is this still aligned, right? But what a lot of people do is, if the answer becomes no, they make it about them. And sometimes, you know, Jamie and I were just talking about this a few days ago. I was saying something along the lines of, like, Isn’t it funny how trends happen? I remember the Pinkberry trend. And every corner there was like, remember that frozen yogurt from like, Korea, right? Pinkberry was everywhere. Dunkin or not, Dunkin Donuts, Krispy Kremes, they were everywhere, right? And then all of a sudden, I saw so many going out of business, signs for pink berries and Krispy Kremes. Did the owner do something wrong? Was it the wrong location? Was it the wrong donut? No trends changed, right? There was a saturation of ice cream places, a saturation of donut places, right? So that’s the other thing. Just because something worked at one point, that doesn’t mean it’s going to work for the life of that program, product, et cetera,

Jamie Berman  21:30  

makes so much sense. And I always think about that like being an entrepreneur, you’re signing up for creativity, because it’s always going to be changing and evolving, and nothing’s concrete. And what works one year may not work. The next year. What worked for the past five years might completely shift and evolve. And so we really do have to be curious, and we have to be creative, and we got to tap into that instead of Oh no, what’s wrong with me? Mentality, which can be easy to go into, but it’s huge. That’s it makes all the difference. And the other thing that, like, what you were talking about, the attachment, and you know, you have to have some level of commitment and intention. And I always like to think of it as like, you have to be wholeheartedly committed, not necessarily attached, but committed. You have to be all in. And that’s the way it is. So I love it. Jill, it’s so good. Okay, so real question that I know some people will probably absolutely love to save, or they might be in the middle of this right now. Maybe you’re in a launch, and you’re in the middle of it and you’re feeling like it’s crickets. I know we’ve all been there, if we’ve had launches, and a lot of times I get the questions, what do I do? What do I do when it’s crickets, like, when I’m I it feels like there’s no one out there interested. But I’m not sure. Do I close the launch early? Do I give up? Do I shift gears? What do I do? Do you have any advice? Because you’ve how many launches have you done at this point? You are too many. But I mean, you’re masterful, and I’m curious what you would recommend during that time.

Jill Esplin  23:10  

Yeah. So I guess when you say it’s cricket, is it if you only had, let’s say again, in the coach world, I’m speaking more to the industry of service providers, and there might be some type of sales event in a launch, right? I also tell people there’s just the reality of a sales conversion and a metric. So if you had, say, 100 people sign up for your free event, it wouldn’t be realistic to think 80 people are going to buy like, never, say never. But unless you have the most engaged and the warmest leads ever, that would be a ridiculously high conversion, right? When I’m saying 80% that means 100 people come to a free event. You offer something and they buy, if they’d bought it 80% and say your offer was $1 then I’d be like, Yeah, that could be realistic, but it’s probably priced too low, right? Like, no one’s going to charge $1 for something. So the biggest thing I also want to look at is conversion. So then the question is, well, how many are in your pipeline? Whether your pipeline is a free event, whether your pipeline is you have a Facebook group, you’re on Instagram, you put an offer out. You also have to be mindful of how many people see it. What you don’t have control over is the algorithm. What you don’t have control over is how things get, you know, fed into someone’s inbox, right? Like more than ever. As I was sharing, things are going to spam. Things aren’t even getting delivered to people. So when it’s quote, unquote crickets, and if you’re a newer coach, that’s when you really, I think, start looking five steps before that is like, what am I doing to nurture, to build relationship, even having people come to a, you know, free event once a month or once a week, like, how are you getting to know people? So when you do offer something, they’re like, oh, I have relationship with you. You are getting to my feed or my inbox or whatever, right? I know. Some big people in the space right now, and I say big people, like big names, who are going to once a week, they’re doing a live webinar. Were never in their career before. Did they build their business on a live webinar once a week? Why are they doing that? Because they need more of a touch point, right? They’re bringing people in, people experience them. And then there’s a call, it a sales call, then there’s a follow up, then there’s a nurture, right? So if it’s crickets, and you’re at the place where you’re like, why aren’t people buying, why aren’t people opening my emails, I would go back and look at again, what’s the offer? Where are people coming from? Is this landing and after the launch, get curious, why send out one of those emails, like, why didn’t you buy and ask some reasons. I did this with a recent client where we had a launch and we had, I’d say, less numbers than we typically would. It was a less, a lower conversion than what would be typical, and we sent an email and we asked, like, why didn’t you buy? And we got a pretty good amount of responses. And the five questions they could answer was something like, I didn’t know the cart closed. Notice what I said. I didn’t know when the cart was closing. I followed up with those people, each one, so I said, I reached out, Hey, Jamie, you know you didn’t know the cart close. We could still enroll you. It’s only three days later. You didn’t miss much. You could get the recording. That’s a way to still re engage. They really didn’t know another one was, like, it was something out of my budget, or I couldn’t afford it. We offered them a down sell, which is like a lower price point program, something like, I wasn’t ready to do a deeper dive right now, or I maxed out on my personal growth. That was just our awareness to see, because that’s the other thing, right? If they’re not investing in your program, what else are they investing in? Sometimes has nothing to do with you. They’re just committed to other programs that one we didn’t actually respond to. There was two other questions on the top of my head. I’m not remembering what they were, but I wrote them in a way where some would trigger a sales outreach and another touch point, and others were just information. So I’m going to sound like a broken record, but I’d go back to get curious right in the middle of a launch. So if you’re like, What do I do in the middle scholarship? What if you did partial scholarship? Right? Hey, apply here, knowing the number one reason people often don’t buy is this idea of, right? I can’t afford it, whether or not that’s true or not. So how do you do a partial scholarship? Apply here. Share your story. What do you need? I would encourage you to put guidelines so like, you know, I’m asking for whatever a range, right? 100 to 500 off check here, 500 to 800 discount, $1,000 discount or more. You know, I’m asking for a full scholarship. And then you could say, you know, we’re not necessarily giving full scholarship right now. We’ll keep that in mind in the future, if that’s true for you and or partial. And I’ve seen that that’s helped. I’ve really seen that’s help people, and also being really in integrity with picking people who you know this work would align, and if it feels in alignment for you, especially if it’s a one to many type program that can work now, if it’s one on one coaching, that’s probably a little bit different. But I was speaking more to like a one to many program if you’re running it anyways, if you could bring in an extra X amount of people, you know what? What does that mean for you and your business? Yeah, that’s

Jamie Berman  28:25  

really great and fantastic. Yeah, another thing that I’ll just mention personally, because I’ve done also a lot of launches, so I’ve got some experience there, and Jill’s been there supporting me for many, many of them. And another thing is just keep holding belief, because I do notice there tends to be, in most of my launches, what I call, quote, unquote messy middle where it just feels like nothing’s happening. It’s not working. Crickets. And I’ve had launches really turn around because I stayed in full commitment the whole time, and I didn’t let it mean it’s not gonna work. Even though I had to process my emotions and move through it, I’ve still stayed wholeheartedly committed. And maybe it did mean get on text. Maybe it did mean do another live call to get people on an informational call. I’ve done open coaching calls, something to get people re engaged and then personally touching out to those people. Are personally reaching out to those people. But I’ve had a handful of launches where over 75% of the people came in on the last two days. And I had one huge launch where 75% came on the last day, we were like, what? Every five minutes it was, here’s another sale and another sale and another sale. And I thought, Oh my gosh. Two days ago, I was thinking I had to change my whole life around here we are. So hold belief. Hold the commitment. So this is what I would say, is if you can just stay in. That commitment, commitment, no matter what the results look like, that’s going to make all the difference, and then do things to re engage with people that can help so much in the partial scholarships. We’ve done that before, and that’s made a difference too, and it’s also allowed some people to be able to come in that wouldn’t have been able to otherwise, who then went on to become clients for many, many years. So, fantastic. Yeah, so

Jill Esplin  30:25  

I was assuming crickets. I was thinking, like, the very end, and you’re like, Okay, right? But the other thing too is you can still add, like, a mid cart bonus, or you could a client, literally, this today, it was supposed to be 12 months access to a program. We were talking this morning on a team call, and she’s like, you know, I think I want to do lifetime access. And I was like, really? And she’s like, Yeah. I was like, well, you opened cart yesterday. We should send an email tomorrow saying, like, you know, more or less, she wrote the email from the place of like, I was talking to my team. I said, I want to do lifetime access. We wrote a story around that, and that’s a huge value lifetime access, which included coaching with the coach lifetime, right? So that became on call it that’d be day three of our launch, a huge pivot that, like, we didn’t necessarily know we were gonna do, but I was like, that’s gonna move the needle, at least getting people interested back to who’s already interested, right? Like, we’re really speaking to those who are interested. So, yeah, there’s a lot of, I’d say, like, levers you can pull during a launch. And as Jamie was saying, it’s like, really holding that belief it’s not over until the very, very last day of that cart close. And we already know most people buy on day one or day five or day whatever the last day is. And those middle days, it’s like, okay, you know, so

Jamie Berman  31:41  

thinking about it totally they do until they know they need to make it, make the move.

Jill Esplin  31:48  

Not everyone has a business that’s launch base, right? Like I worked with a client for two years that they have ongoing on evergreen, not evergreen. It was like a service based business, right? They were selling a service, and they people would have a call, and then we would match them. It is in the publishing industry, so if they needed an editor or writer, right? So that’s ongoing throughout the year, right? So if you have a business where you’re selling something that’s throughout the year, it’s a live deliverable, or you’re selling, in that case, it was, you know, Editorial Services, right? So it’s like that sales process. It’s very different if you’re doing something that’s timely, or if you’re doing something ongoing. But no matter what, I’d always say the key is, right? Give an opportunity to experience whatever it is. Have a some type of activating event, a lead gen, whether it’s paid traffic or organic, and then, like, nurture them if they have had a call, or if they’ve opted in on something, even if you’re talking on Instagram, right? Like, really using that opportunity to connect human to human, because you could be enrolling, I’m thinking like people who do private coaching, you’re enrolling year round. That’s not just like during a launch, you know? So it’s like, those come in year round. What makes, oh,

Jamie Berman  33:06  

yeah,

Jill Esplin  33:07  

those people when you’re when you’re when you’re like a coach, for example, you’re enrolling year round. It doesn’t mean you’re having a sales activator event, but I would encourage you to do something monthly. Or, you know, in some way that someone gets to experience you, but you’re also enrolling ongoing. So how are you continually connecting in with people? And the biggest thing, I think, is being real, connecting, then giving them an opportunity to actually get to to work with you. That’s a lot of sales aren’t happening because they aren’t even giving an opportunity to work with them or telling them how to Yeah. Yeah,

Jamie Berman  33:40  

yep. Oh, you know what else I love that you were sharing with me earlier is how on average, Jill was telling me, on average, someone needs to consume about seven hours of your content, or have seven hours of time with you, or emails, or whatever it is before they buy that’s typically the average so helpful to know and to think about when you’re Like putting content out in the world and nurturing people.

Jill Esplin  34:03  

They’re rarely gonna see one carousel and be like, I’m gonna hire you as a coach, right? They’ve probably listened to your podcast. In Jamie’s case, if you’re listening, I’m assuming if you’ve bought a program with her, or if you’ve thought about buying a program, my guess is you’ve listened to the podcast, which is hours upon hours upon hours, or YouTube, like long form or some way, though, but very rarely, someone’s gonna go, Hey, I saw one Instagram or one reel, and let me work with you. Yeah,

Jamie Berman  34:30  

totally, I love it so much. Okay, I have one final question for you, because this is the money manifestation or, sorry, because this is the money manifestation in business podcasts, we talk about identity a lot. So I’m curious if someone wants to embody the identity of a good salesperson, like someone who’s good at sales, if they decide I want to become that person, what would they need to embody? Whether that’s a way of thinking, a. Way of feeling or way of being. What would you say that might be?

Jill Esplin  35:06  

Yeah, I think the two biggest qualities to embody would be like curiosity and caring, and like truly being curious about that other person and truly caring and being a stand for them. And I think those two go hand in hand. And, you know, people will say, Oh my gosh, Jill, you could sell a, you know, what do you call it an Eskimo ice or, you know, someone who, like, you know, doesn’t need ice. And here, I could sell them ice. They live in an igloo, right? And it’s like, well, I don’t know if I actually would, if they’re living in an igloo, like they wouldn’t need the ice, like I actually care. And I think people could feel that, and then the curiosity, right? It’s like, what do they really need? How can you ask so many questions? So by the end, you’re like, here is why you need this. And better yet, they’re telling you why they need that because you’ve done such a good job like asking questions, helping them connect the dots. Really, the last question they should be asking is like, how do I join? You know, that’s like the last question that I feel like someone should be asking they’re sitting on the edge of their seat, if it’s on a call or if it’s at a free event, at the very end it’s like, where do I join? How much is it? That means you’ve done a great job really setting it up and really helping connect the dots for them to see why it’s a good fit for them.

Jamie Berman  36:20  

I love it. Thank you so much, Jill, for all of your wisdom and magic and for coming on and sharing. Love it so much. And where you want to let people know, where they can find you if they want, maybe to bring someone in as a support in their business, for selling or Yeah,

Jill Esplin  36:38  

yeah, for sure. So most of my work. I don’t have a big landing page. It’s all been through word of mouth. I’ve been in the industry for literally over 15 years. And you can reach out to Jamie, she’ll connect us and or, literally, my personal email, esplen Jill, E, S, P, L, I N Jill, j, i, L, L, at Gmail, she’ll put that in the show notes. Or you can just reach out to Jamie and say, Hey, I’d love to talk to Jill. I love working with people in terms of, if you have, like, limiting beliefs around selling, if you’re like, How can I become a better salesperson? Can you audit the sales funnel? Yes, yes and yes,

Jamie Berman  37:12  

yes, she’s the best I’m telling you. I was so grateful. Thank you so much, Jill, I realized I didn’t do an i.